What did Stander tell Oldwage?


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The defence argued that Oscar could not have known that Dr and Mrs Stipp would testify about the first sounds and the seconds sounds. Is this true?

In their Heads of Argument the defence stated:

287. When the Accused deposed to his bail affidavit, he was neither privy to the statements in the police docket nor to the evidence to be led at the bail application. He could not have known that Dr Stipp and Mrs Stipp would testify about the first sounds and the second sounds. This underlines his credibility in this regard.

Judge Masipa concurred:

Counsel for the defence correctly argued that it was highly improbable that the accused would have made this up so quickly and be consistent in his version, even at the bail application before he had access to the police docket and before he was privy to the evidence on behalf of the state at the bail application.

Mr Stander testified that while he and Dr Stipp were talking that evening outside Oscar’s house, he asked him what he had heard. Stipp supposedly told him that he heard four shots, silence, screams and again four shots. Before Stipp left the scene Stander asked him for his phone number in case the police may want to speak to him later.

[Stander] Mr Stipp was with me outside then. Sorry M’Lady, Doctor Stipp. I asked him what happened. If he heard anything, because he was staying … he said he was staying just behind Oscar. He said to me: He heard four shots, silence, screams and four shots again and then he mentioned to me that he cannot do anything. He is going to leave. I asked him his telephone number to give it to the police if they asked for it. (Record 2144, Lines 19–26)

(It is curious and somewhat suspicious that Stander recalled something very different than what Stipp swore to under oath – three shots, screaming moments later and then three shots.)

We also know that Adv Kenny Oldwage arrived on the scene that night. We also know that Stander and Oldwage talked at some point that morning and that Stipp came up in discussion. At 04:30 Stander called Stipp to inform him that he had passed his phone number to the defence lawyer (i.e. Adv Kenny Oldwage) who would be contacting him.

There is just one other small detail, but you phoned Doctor Stipp later. — That is correct, M’Lady.

And indicated to him that the defence might be in contact with him? — That is correct.

You just wanted to check his number. — That is correct, M’Lady.

Why did you do that? — In my mind, it is the right thing to do.  if M’Lady, you give your number to me, and I give it to Mr X, then it is good manners and the right thing to do, to inform you saying I gave your number to this person, he will probably phone you.  That is only [intervene].

So when you phone him, you already gave his number to the defence? —That is correct, yes.

Who did you give the number to? — I gave it to Advocate Oldwage.

Okay. So when you phoned Mr Stipp earlier that morning, you already gave his number to Mr Oldwage? — That is correct, yes. (Record 2166, Lines 4–19)

We also know that Oscar didn’t do his own bail affidavit:

M’Lady … when my bail was done, it was done by my legal team. It was read to me in a holding cell. I was on medication. I was traumatised. I read it and it was the truth and I signed it, M’Lady. (Record 1825, Lines 1–4)

It is highly, to extremely, likely that Oldwage was part of the legal team that drafted Oscar’s bail affidavit and indications are that he likely knew about the shots and screaming Dr Stipp heard, prior to his involvement in the bail affidavit. When Stander gave away Dr Stipp’s  phone number it is not unrealistic to assume that Stander also told Oldwage what Dr Stipp told him about the shots and screaming. What are the chances that Oldwage didn’t in turn pass this information on to Oscar?


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